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    Is Gary Ragland's Episode Four meant to be an extension of new30?

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    WolfForever
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    Is Gary Ragland's Episode Four meant to be an extension of new30?

    Post by WolfForever on Tue Dec 18, 2012 11:30 am

    This is more or less just a quick question with no real implications based on it, but do you think Gary Ragland released his mapset called Episode Four intending it to be a continuation/extension of his first mapset new30 (which replaced episodes one through three)?

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    Re: Is Gary Ragland's Episode Four meant to be an extension of new30?

    Post by Guest on Tue Dec 18, 2012 12:30 pm

    Hi Vernon!


    Last edited by Chokster37 on Sat Feb 08, 2014 12:35 pm; edited 1 time in total

    Thomas
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    Re: Is Gary Ragland's Episode Four meant to be an extension of new30?

    Post by Thomas on Tue Dec 18, 2012 12:41 pm

    I agree with Chris here. The setup of the mods/episodes seems very likely here. new30... I don't know. I also agree with Chris there. It is a sort of "b-side" thing as he mentioned (I use that term about using maps that appear only in demos of larger mods) to be brought out, not to be enjoyed as a full-scale modification with a certain feeling of time and space. I also recall Gary talking about an Episode 1 epic (supposedly with 128 x 128 maps or something of the sort) - and again, Episode 5. It always gets forgotten. It's sad, really. The original episode has so many textures, uses all guards sans mutants. I suppose it's the boss, Gretel, and the fact that it's ridiculously easy to kill her that takes the cake on that one.

    Episode 4... Oh, that opening level! How the hell did he do it.

    WolfForever
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    Re: Is Gary Ragland's Episode Four meant to be an extension of new30?

    Post by WolfForever on Tue Dec 18, 2012 1:56 pm

    (Deleted the poll, because it doesn't really seem as if there's any need to have one to go with the topic at this point. Maybe this could get moved to Addons, Mods, etc. section?)

    I pretty much tend to trust Chris whenever he's serious so I'd have to tend to agree here too. What is a "b-side type set", though?

    The idea that every set Gary made other than new30 (which was his first release of any kind ever) was based on a single Wolf3D episode (and each one, a different episode) occurred to me too. Which episode is pretty much clear by the name except for Countdown to Disaster as I don't see a clear tie between that name and the plot of Episode 6 (Confrontation). He took Schabbs 2000 out way further than the rest of them, though; Episode 4 is a normal length episodes (in fact it's just a mapset), Countdown to Disaster is a little over 1 1/2 times a regular episode length though four keys make the levels longer, Assassinate Hitler is double a normal episode though with only two keys, and Schabbs 2000 is a huge 50 levels and eventually has four keys to boot. It doesn't matter as far as story; I just can't help but notice that S2000's size makes the other three episode tributes seem like minigames/afterthoughts even though they're not and in reality are probably close to if not just as good.

    Now technically one could argue that new30 is a remake of the Original Missions since what's in each episode adheres to that episode in the original game, but this would bring about two issues:

    1) E2 already has Schabbs 2000 and E3 already has Assassinate Hitler.
    2) I seem to recall playing part of E1 in new30 and then quitting it because I just was not having that much fun. I've played Schabbs 2000, Assassinate Hitler, and Countdown to Disaster all at least once and never got that feeling at all; there was very good mapping throughout. And everyone here is telling me Episode Four is just as good with its mapping (got to get to that one!). But it leaves me to question if it is just me or if there really is rather a lack of quality in new30 compared to all the others (or maybe it's just E1 since that is presumably the VERY first thing he ever made, assuming he mapped the game in order). I'd wonder what Chris, Thomas, and/or others have to say regarding this. (That would also be another reason to argue for keeping them separate, if the quality/style of mapping in new30 is vastly different [in this case, inferior] to that in Episode Four.)

    Finally - Re Episode 5, I don't know of any "epics" dedicated to it, but Episode 5 in a lot of 60-level Wolf3D sets that are mapped to keep the original flavor clearly adhere to its story, i.e. IPank's Wolf3D, Thomas' Wolfenstein 3D, the DHW SDL set, Conflict in the Fatherland, and possibly (probably several) others.

    I do agree though, that considering Gary didn't mind dedicating just a very good plain mapset (plain mapset = strictly nothing new except GAMEMAPS and MAPHEAD files) to an episode (Episode Four), it would have been nice to see Episode Five from him in the same vein even if he didn't want to do any coding for a tribute set to this particular episode.

    p.s. Some quick trivia: new30 actually runs into E4, through E4L5, despite the fact that it isn't stated anywhere. Then E4L6 is an unfinished map. There are even a few oddly changed levels in E5, though one of the (E5L10) is an (illegal?) near ripoff of Spear of Destiny's Level 6.

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    Re: Is Gary Ragland's Episode Four meant to be an extension of new30?

    Post by Andy on Tue Dec 18, 2012 2:33 pm

    @WolfForever wrote:What is a "b-side type set", though?
    You young'uns...back in the olden days we used to have our music on these things called "records" or LPs (long players) or 45's (single records). The single records were ususally "hits" from an LP, or maybe just a standalone song, that made the "top-40" on the radio, which used to be a big deal before radio became the format-restricted abomination that no one listens to today. But I digress....

    Anyway, each of these records had two sides, an a-side and a b-side. The b-side to a single was usually a not-so-commercial, maybe experimental, sometimes shitty, song. In any case, the b-side was usually not a hit, not the main focus of the release, and often forgettable, except to fanatical fans who find them fascinating (like trivia is fascinating).

    So "b-side type set" is kind of an experimental/not the main deal/filler type of set, I guess.

    Does this make sense? I hope so... Razz

    WolfForever
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    Re: Is Gary Ragland's Episode Four meant to be an extension of new30?

    Post by WolfForever on Tue Dec 18, 2012 2:41 pm

    Yeah that makes good sense in the context of that particular question, thanks.

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